#59 Mindful Meditation with Michael Sugarman
Going from shame to pride is accepting, not only the stuttering but your whole self.
- Michael Sugarman
Listen to this episode on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Google Podcasts or your favorite podcast platform. You can also watch the interview on YouTube.
BIO:
Michael Sugarman has been an activist in the stuttering and disability communities since the 1970s. He was co-founder and former Executive Director of the National Stuttering Project and former chair of the International Stuttering Association. Michael wrote for academic journals and promoted people-first language and stuttering awareness in “It’s Ok to Stutter” (Journal of Fluency Disorders) and the Perniciousness of Labels (Transactional Analysis Journal). As a medical social worker, he recently updated his children’s book, The Adventures of Phil and Dotty. Michael currently co-facilitates a peer support group and is co-writing an article on peer and professional facilitation of support groups, emphasizing mindfulness communication, self-care skills, and resilience.
EPISODE HIGHLIGHTS
0:00-4:53 -Opening Remarks
4:53-7:06 -Introducing Anita Blom
7:06-10:41- Anita’s Response to Uri’s Question: How is mindfulness or mental health meaningful to you in your personal journey or in the context of, your country, community, or the stuttering community in your country?
10:41-11:19 -Introducing Stephen Green
11:19-14:11-Stephen’s Response to Uri’s Question
14:11-15:42- Introducing Farah Al Qaissieh
15:42-19:01 -Farah’s Response to Uri’s Question
19:01-20:41 -Introducing Michael
20:41-28:48 -Michael's Journey with Stuttering and his Career Path
28:48-36:34 -Michael Explains Transformation Model
36:34-38:29 -Group Discussion on the Meaning of “Change”
38:29-42:37 -Michael’s Thoughts on Mental Health and Meditation App “Shine”
42:37-43:33 -Laughing Yoga Demonstration
43:33-44:10 -Discussing Self Care
44:10-48:53 -Michael Leads a Meditation Exercise
48:53-55:49 -Group Reflection on Meditation Exercise Experiences
55:49-01:01:19 -Uri and Michael Share Thoughts on Meditation and Mind & Body Process
01:01:19-01:09:17 -Closing Remarks
RESOURCE LIST
(1980) "It's OK to Stutter: A Personal Account" Journal of Fluency Disorders, (5) 149 - 157
MORE QUOTES
“It's not just like the like the calming down part, the meditation part, but the part of being here in the moment. Let go of the past and don't predict the future and what you cannot change, let it go. What you can change, go for it. And that has changed my, my, my whole being, because of that, I can now accept my stutter.” -Anita B.
“Nobody starts off saying this mechanical tool, this speech technique, changed my life. That's what I attribute my entire transformation to. The majority of people had some sort of experience, some sort of breakthrough that had to do with inner space that had to do with the way they think. And the way they feel not to the exclusion of all else, but as an opener to all else.” -Uri Schneider
TRANSCRIPTION:
Uri Schneider: Good morning. And what a special morning it is joined by not just one incredible friend, incredible person, but a collection of human beings who are among the greatest. I'm proud to call them mentors and friends and to come together and talk about something that's so important to all of us. So my name is Uri Schneider.
I lead at Schneider speech and this transcending stuttering project. And today we're combining and bringing together the coalescence of it's stuttering community. And what we know is important in the journey of transcending stuttering. And I think if you wanted a textbook on transcending stuttering, you can just look at the people here.
And I think one more person who's joining us, but they embody everything that we need to learn and see, which is that it's a dynamic personal journey. It has its ups. It has its challenges. It's not linear and there's no one formula for everybody, but but it's a living and breathing thing. And sometimes as you go through that, you have less stuttering on the surface that can happen.
And sometimes you go through that and you actually start talking. So people see a stutter more that could happen and you could be happier and freer, and then you can also dance between those things. And no two people are the same, but what is important, and what's exciting is that when we bring people together and my father in 2004, with the film transcending, stuttering, which is available for free, check it out, Schneider speech.com/movies.
There are a handful of people featured in that film, men, women, people of all color, creed, and culture, and the universality of their experiences is what comes through the film. And there are hundreds, more people. Whose stories are captured, but didn't make it into the final cut, but here's, what's profound.
My father has worked with thousands of people, Dr. Phil Schneider, I have had the privilege to work with probably a few thousand myself. These podcasts are close to 60 conversations. Many of them with researchers, people who stutter and loved ones. And what shines through consistently is when you look at people who get to the other side, when you look and talk to people and you listen to people, what was most helpful?
It's not to the exclusion of all else, but nobody starts off saying this mechanical tool. This speech technique changed my life. That's what I attribute my entire transformation. to The majority of people had some sort of experience, some sort of breakthrough that had to do with inner space that had to do with the way they think.
And the way they feel not to the exclusion of all else, but as an opener to all else. And so it's super exciting today to be with these friends and mentors and to have with us Michael Sugarman Michael Sherman is someone who is nearly impossible to introduce. He's a legend. He is someone who really was at the forefront of so many things that we see today.
And in many ways we owe him a huge debt of gratitude for which he's not asking for anything, but he deserves our thanks because it's on the shoulders of his work and others that we stand on their shoulders for so much of the good that we have. So just to tell you a little bit about Michael and what we're going to do today, we're going to get to hear from people from around the world of what mindfulness and this whole mental health, mental wellness; what it means to them, how it's been relevant, personal, meaningful, significant for them. And also considering perhaps culture. We have different people from different parts of the world. And then we'll hear from Michael. Who's going to bring a tremendous amount of wisdom and perspective and talk to us about a term transformation.
He's always gonna introduce us to some apps and he's also going to take us through the main course for today. The main course is going to be a mindful meditation led by a master guide. So without further ado, I'm going to introduce Michael, just so those of you that don't know him know you're in the presence of someone extraordinary.
And then we'll go pass the mic around to do some checking in with our friends. And then we'll circle back to Michael. So just so you know, Michael Sugarman has been well, you know what, I'll save your intro about that. We'll start with Anita. And then we'll circle around for those of you that are watching, please drop your comments, your likes, your shares, help more people get this because it's worth getting.
And for those of you that are listening, I hope that my descriptions can offer you some visualization. And Michael helped me with that later, but we'll start with Anita and hear from her.
Introducing Anita
Uri Schneider: But just as an intro, Anita Blom was born and raised in the Netherlands. She lives in Sweden. She's worked as a teacher and operation manager for the workers education association.
She's been active as a chairperson board member and advisory board member of local national European and international stuttering organizations. She's a stuttering activist that's worked for decades to break down barriers and improve the lives of people who stuttered around the world. She was a national and international keynote speaker on stuttering.
She had her own consulting firm on stuttering and motivation. And has been a project leader of several stuttering projects. She was also a leader of national and international children and youth camps for over 20 years. Anita, AKA has stuttered since she was nine and had troublesome youth because of her stuttering.
She went from being silent to giving stuttering a voice from preschool children's European parliament now inspiring people who stutter of all ages, that they can make a difference due to her personal health issues, she's now taking it a bit slower, but it's still an inspiration to so many people, including myself.
She's acknowledged by the voice on earth, on the wall of inspiration and many others and her device that or phrase that's been used around the world that is "Sure I stutter. What are you good at?" And I'll just add one sentence, which is, "Everything that is transcending stuttering, owes a debt of gratitude to both Michael and Anita."
They're both on the advisory team and Anita's a tooth and comb review of many of the things that I wrote up wouldn't look the same, and I wouldn't be as informed if not for her to keep dedication and input and the back and forth that we shared with some of the sweetest, some of the sweetest and most thoughtful and thought provoking that I had in the process of developing this.
So without further ado cast the mic to Anita. The question is why, or how is mindfulness or mental health meaningful to you in your personal journey or in the context of, your country, community, your stuttering community in your country?
Anita's Response to Why Mindfulness is Meaningful
Anita: Wow.
That's a lot of wonderful words. I have to re-find my voice. To give a short answer, if it weren't for the help that I got, I wouldn't be here. I wouldn't be alive because my stuttering and everything that went that was going on around me near nearly killed me because my mental health was down because of my stuttering.
And because all these people telling me I was not good enough, I shouldn't be there. So if I would've had it'll help there, I would have had so much more courage to stutter. And later on, I also had for frustrations about work, about people in my life. I got an illness and suddenly I found mindfulness and mindfulness helped me to give it all space and to put everything in perspective.
It's not just like the like the calming down part, the meditation part, but the part of being here in the moment, let go of the past and don't predict in the future and what you cannot change and let it go and what you can change goal for it. And that has changed my, my, my whole being, because of that, I can now accept my stutter.
I can do something about it. I can choose not to do anything about it and still feel good. About me and thanks to that, I had learned lots of speech techniques, but I couldn't use them because I didn't feel good within me. And as soon as I learned to, to accept me first, I to be in the moment from that moment on, I could talk and I could be me and I could choose to use therapy.
I could choose to use the techniques and to be the full me. So that's thanks to mindfulness. So I'm really looking forward to, to hear Michael talk more about mindfulness.
Uri Schneider: If I had any doubts of the order of what I signed up for today, we had a discussion a few moments ago. Should we start with jumping into the.
Information and wisdom and experience that Michael can share, or should we kind of line it up with a lead off batter and three of them, and then have Michael bet cleanup for those Americans that understand baseball Anita, what a wonderful lead off. And it really sets the stage of, I think the biggest question we all should be asking ourselves in anything in life is why what's our why are we doing this?
And therapist and teachers and parents stop and ask why? And and then everything becomes much more meaningful and much more relevant. And we also can remove and eliminate a lot of the stuff that we just do, just because, so I think I wanted everyone to really hear the personal experiences and reflections to show the why mental health matters and why meditation and mindfulness can be such powerful tools.
So Anita, I think that was extremely powerful. And I want to thank you for sharing that.
Introducing Stephen
Uri Schneider: I'll pass over to from Sweden, we go to Ireland. My good friend, Stephen Green stay tuned is coming up on an episode shortly as well. Stephen's a person who stutters from Belbin Ireland. How was that? Former chair of the Irish stammering association, current support group leader, a social care worker, working with people with disabilities for 20 years, a proud husband and father who loves travel and exploring different cultures.
And he also is a person who stutters. So thanks for coming and joining us, Stephen. So what will you reflect on this?
Stephen's Response to Why Mindfullness is Meaningful
Stephen: Thank you very much Uri for the introduction, when I was thinking about mindfulness and mental health As a person it just helps to navigate me through the day to day life because because then what happens is sometimes when things go really crazy as a person, you just really have to just take yourself down and just focus on yourself.
To just get to that kind of calm, and moment to ask, just to ask yourself the questions. Okay.
here, I think it also really helps me to be present for the important people in my life. So like my wife and my family people that I work with just like my circle of friends as a person who stutters, I think mindfulness and mental health, I think it's very important to me because I have such a passion for support nature of stuttering and reaching out and being able to facilitate people to talk about their own stutter and journey.
And I think. The more influence aspects helps me to stay grounded because sometimes when the passion just it is hard to tame it, so it is hard to just to keepit under control so to stop me from getting disappointed, if maybe stopped me from getting disappointed, maybe if something isn't being achieved or isn't being achieved quickly what can I do as a person to internalize that walk through it.
I think that's how mindfulness and mental health has been very important to my self and my family as well.
Uri Schneider: Steven. Thank you so much. How was my Irish accent?
Stephen: And I'll give you maybe a five out of ten.
Uri Schneider: The name I'm working with Daniel Day Lewis to see what I can do. I promise that when I work with young people who stutter, one of the things we like to do is switch seats like physically and in position and have them teach us how to stutter and in doing so, they get a chance to explore it from the inside, from the outside, however you want to call it, but I promise you my, my stuttering, that I can embody to the best of my ability, which is not, I don't stutter.
I'm not wired to stutter, but I can step into that accent with the help of some friends, better than I do my Irish accent. I just want to assure you of that.
Introducing Farah
Uri Schneider: So with that, we are very fortunate to have a very special guest, a new friend, Farrah Al Qaissieh from Dubai. And so glad that she could join us as well, bringing another perspective and voice to the crowd.
She had to take care of some other responsibilities, which is the first thing she put in her intro above all else. She's a mother to three boys. So we're so glad that you could carve the time to be with us. And certainly you came right on time, right on cue. She's also in addition to being proud, mom of three boys, she's an award-winning social entrepreneur and a clinical hypnotherapist Farrah's passionate advocate for the inclusion of people who stutter and the mental health and wellbeing of parents.
And the fact that she comes from Dubai. She brings another cultural perspective. As every individual person does in the context of the culture of their family and of their community, but also different parts of the world. And one of the things I wanted to highlight here is the universality. It can look different, but the universality of the experience of stuttering and also the universality and where you are in the globe the importance of looking at mental health and the role of talking about things and engaging tools no matter where you're from and no matter what you look like the importance of that.
Farah the question is why, or how is mindfulness or mental health meaningful to you in your own personal journey or in the context of your community, where you come from? Thanks for joining us.
Farah's Response to Why Minfulness is Meaningful
Farah: Hi everyone. Thank you very much for having me. It's truly an honor, and I'm glad they caught it when I did.
I hope my the voices. All right. For me, mindfulness was something that I've always been passionate about. So it's something that that guided me and everything that I do. And I think it's originated with the fact that I stutter and having been able to go through that journey of hating myself, hating my stutter, hating speaking, to being a representative of the people who stutter here in the UAE has been a very interesting journey and if it wasn't for mindfulness, if it wasn't for the community that supported me as don't think I would have been able to be here where I am.
For me, mindfulness has a lot to do with understanding myself, understanding that there will be days very stutter. There will be days where despite being so comfortable with the fact that I stutter, I need to be mindful that there will be days where it might win the battle. And put me back to when I was a kid, when I was very ashamed of my stutter and being able to step out of the moment and observe situation in a more objective way.
That's how I view mindfulness and that's how it really helped me throughout my journey. And especially as a mother mainly because as a primary caregiver, I'd want to be able to teach my kids, guide them. And mind you with all three of my kids are under three, but with the moments where I catch myself stuttering, while I'm trying to teach them something or explain something and they give me that look and go is you're not speaking like the rest of the house.
There's something different. And even though they don't say it, it's something that I sense. And that's where I need to be mindful of myself. Is it something that I am that's within me that I'm, that's being projected and it's reflecting back on me. Children don't know especially at that age fluency, they don't know how one should speak, but because I know how it is.
I'm aware of how it feels. It's it starting to play a lot in my head. So going into hypnotherapy, truly helped me and understanding and embracing those uncertain or weird or unfamiliar emotions.
Uri Schneider: Wow.
I don't want to take a second away from Michael, but I also can't resist just to say if not for stuttering, I wouldn't have a chance to be connected to these incredible individuals.
And as much as we come from different parts of the world and have so much different between us, I find it awesome
that we come together here. So without further ado, I think you could all hear the words between the tears there.
Introducing Michael
Uri Schneider: So now to introduce, as I said, I would hold off introducing Michael until now. Now I've just got to find where I stuck it because, okay, here we go. Here's his bio. I'm not going to let you push me off here.
Hold on. Here we go. Michael, here we go. As I said, we all really stand on the shoulders of others, whether it's our parents, whether it's other people who try to pass before us or open doors for us. But Michael Sugarman is someone that we all have gratitude for and standing on his shoulders. And it's such a treat to have him.
and be so generous to share ongoing with us. Mike has been an activist in the stutteringand disability communities since the 1970s. Can you believe that? Founder, former executive director of the national stuttering project in the US and former chair of the international stuttering association, Michael wrote for academic journals, promoted people, first language and stuttering awareness.
And that it's okay to stutter, which was an epic groundbreaking piece in the journal of fluency disorders and the perniciousness of labels and transactional analysis journal as a medical social worker. So a professional medical social worker. So not only coming at this from a person who stutters, but from the professional side, he's recently updated his children's book, the adventures of Phil and Dottie.
And he just doesn't stop and he continues to evolve and he continues to give back and he continues to be engaged. And it's an honor and a privilege to have him on the advisory team of the transcending stuttering community platform. And without further ado Michael, we're all listening.
Michael's Journey with Stuttering and his Career Path
Michael Sugarman: Okay, thank you to everybody.
And I'm humbled and honored to be with you to join, and we could share this journey. The other thing is thank you, Uri today is mental health action day. We have a thousand corporations that are taking part of it, and as well as that, we have 30 countries around the world. So I'm going to begin with a couple of quotes that I would like you to think about from Martin Luther king.
"You don't have to see the whole staircase, just the first step."
From Maya Angelo, "There's no greater agony than bearing an untold story inside you." So mental health, and disabilities, stuttering go hand-in-hand and mindfulness, is this what we're doing now. And in the therapeutic world is called mindfulness based intervention, but I'll tell you a little bit about my journey first, and then we'll get into this transformation idea concept.
In 1976 that I was a student a bachelor's degree student in sociology at UC Santa Barbara. And it took me three sessions with the school psychologist to finally say that I stuttered took me three times. I knew what was going on, but to get it out, like what Maya Angelo said. So fortunately, like I went to the speech clinic there and I walked in and I'm ready now.
I'm ready. I have the feelings I'm going to work on my stutter. They told me you have to come back in a week to do my first assessment. So now I have to wait the entire week to get that appointment, to begin this process. So I, I came back and for six months I dwelled on to my own mental health as well as speech therapy.
So I had the opportunity to evolve what was going on with me at that moment in time. So then I left this or I was clinically fluent from the clinic and then that famous conversation I have to have with the clinicians. Oh, you know that you could have a relapse in a year? Yeah, I just spent six, two days a week clinic time.
So at UC Santa Barbara, there was a sign that said to become a university of California student lobbyist at our state Capitol in Sacramento or a university of California student lobbyists in Washington. I'm a California boy and being from California, thinking, going to the east coast during the winter did not sit too well to me.
So I chose Sacramento, our state Capitol and lo and behold that's where my journey really took off. And I was really fortunate. So I met Bob and other people who stuttered on and that's where, the stuttering project John Harris and John Alback that as well as what was going on in Sacramento was people with psychiatric disabilities took over the governor's mansion and wanted services.
That was the beginning of what was commonly known as mad pride. So the mental health community was saying like, whoa, wait a second. We want to start, to get our services. And right within one month I was fortunate because I was up in Northern California was the famous Crip camp, which you may have seen on films or anything like that.
And that is the takeover of the federal building. That was a natural thing for me to do was to go to the demonstration and disability rights, mental health rights, and for people who stutter. So I went back to Santa Barbara, I graduated, I came back up to Oakland and so the famous thing is center for independent living.
That was a Mecca center that people know about for the disability rights movement, but there is also, the other movement was self care and peer support. And at that time you have to remember that in Berkeley, California. So we had people from Cal, graduate students in social work, in psychology coming in, we have people from Stanford coming in and we have people from UC Med.
And it was just like, what Uri is doing with his cohorts is sitting down in a round. And we were talking about how to develop peer support and peer counseling for the community. So there's mental health, disability, and stuttering. The group that I was in for the NSP was the Oakland based one. And fortunately for me, w we're around the same age group and, graduate school and go into social work school or psychology or social psych.
Now I was a graduate student and trying to get my PhD in sociology. So now you have to mind frame here in mindset. This is the late seventies. My advisor said, Mike, it sounds like you really want to become a social worker, not a disability studies. What is that? I said it seems like a new movement that's happening.
There's a mental health movement and a disability rights movement. We're trying to combine. So lo and behold I was advised to become a social worker. Now, remember this is late seventies. So what Uri said was all these things that came out of that was that whole concept of this cohort that Uri is doing is basically all of these people were getting together from all kinds of disabilities.
And mental health and we're all talking and that's where this all things per person, first language came up and it's okay. So then fortunately for me that I got to I got my degree and it became a master's degree in social work. And my first job was at Stanford med. Now at Stanford med, there was a lot of things that were going on.
And I'll move this really quick now because that's going to be key. So at Stanford med there was this another thing like Uri was saying it was a cohort. So in medical it was a medical social work. So a lot of us saw the motto of that you've offered the social and medical disability model.
For us, we looked at it as a psychosocial disability model and a psychiatric disability model, very similar social model. And so some of us, thought this concept. So if we bring the transformation I'll circle that right now.
Uri Schneider: Would you like me? Would you like me to share the screen on that? Yeah, sure. Let me pull that up.
Michael Sugarman: Okay. Okay. For okay, so this particular month and talking to people
Uri Schneider: just for people that may be listening that can't see it, I'm going to post this image into the Facebook feed. And I will also share it on the blog posts on Schneider speech.com/ourblog. So anyone that wants to see it, it's something Michael put together, but he's going to talk us through it.
Okay.
Michael Explains Transformation Model
Michael Sugarman: To talk through this. Okay. During the time of, when I worked in as a clinical social worker with aids folks are, is those, this dichotomy, this this dialectic of looking at shame. Which was what came and to looking at pride and there's a dialectic there, that's going on, the personal experience and the transformation to become prideful.
So how do you get to there? So being a therapist or I'm interested in that process, like what Anita was saying. Stephen was saying what we are all saying with this whole group what's that process of feeling better about herself now, today, it's interesting talking about mindfulness because the big push is towards yoga and mindfulness and safe spaces.
In a psychosocial model, this is what I came up with. So the individual experience is a stutter shame and stutter and anxiety. Now here comes where it comes a disability model, and that is stutter, ableism fluency, because those are the expectations that society has on us. And so we go through this process of looking at shame, pride in how you'd get there.
The middle path is these paths to, of of transformation and stutter, acceptance. The radical acceptance today is mental health day. So we have found that acceptance has shown to reduce the feelings of shame and anxiety. The acceptance of. Of talking about what's going on for you is linked to lower rates of suicide and dealing with negative thoughts.
Just a thing that we use in the mental health community. So as you could see through this, like it's interesting because I went to a webinar that I know some of the folks from it was the peer ERG movement in mental health. And when I say ERG do you folks know what that means? Okay.
So today is really going to be a really so I said there's a thousand corporations, they're called employment resource groups. And there, so I listed those under stutter support. And what what Uri was talking about safe spaces. That's the key word now so we're trying to create, and corporations now are trying to create this safe space.
Because I'm here in the bay area, I've been talking to folks, in our groups. I've been asking that because everybody's on zoom. And so what's been the dynamic with your supervisor.
So it's okay. So one person said the supervisor introduced the person with a stutter to the zoom group. Another person said the supervisor introduced the person who stuttered to the zoom group. One person was totally mad about it. And the other person saying that was fine about it.
So now we're coming into this employment resource groups that are going to be available not only in mental health, but in disability groups. So those are going to be, you're starting to read about them now, but Microsoft, just Google. Everybody is jumping in on these creating like a peer safe space for people to talk about these things.
And should I say and add to the group? Mindfulness is the first thing is talking about being okay and talking about your issues, is that all makes sense? So this brings up really Uri because I attended a peer group
Uri Schneider: not only does it make sense, but there are people from around the world to drop in their comments, how much they are grateful, Michael for what you're sharing.
Michael Sugarman: Okay.
Uri Schneider: Really eating it up. Thank you. Thank you then everybody here. I know as well.
So naturally there's a peer movement in the mental health community, so they just gave a talk and they're the ones who are pushing the us employment resource groups throughout the country and probably throughout the world that we'll start to see.
So I decided to ask, now you have to remember, they're not therapists they're peers. So I asked that question too to the group, so how do you want to deal with this. You have mental health issue, you have and the peer, the three people said they'd better get out there and tell their story.
So out of that came, after conversations with the cohort talking to Vivian, Chyanne about change the word change versus transformation. So naturally I've been going to a couple of the webinars and during this month and reconnecting with some friends and so in a psychosocial disability model in the field, we don't really have a model of this going from a shame to a pride.
Michael Sugarman: If you want to show that again, that'd be fine.
Uri Schneider: Sure. Let me pull that back.
Michael Sugarman: So this is all makes sense to everybody. Okay. That's the important thing. Okay so not only, so when when you go to a therapist you're taught these clinical skills, but also what we're doing is that we're combining the whole self is saying then maybe you should consider taking a yoga class and taking a mindful class and integrating the whole society.
So if you notice so what I try to do here is an a model for us, people that stutter because I'm basically to coming back home and it feels really safe to try this out cause that's, it's safe. So thank you. So if you look at it, self-care is a really big action amongst today because you're taking action and support the physical and emotional wellbeing.
So not only are we moving ourselves from the individual, but we're trying to transform society. And as you can see, the dialectic is feeling shame and feeling not shame. Also the dialectic to that is this ableism. And making us feel bad because that's the ableist view is a societal view is stutter, inclusivity, creating, adjust, and assessable communities, environments for us.
And that's, what's occurring now. And that's where we are all this stuff that's going on today. Yeah, that's what we're trying to move people towards.
Uri Schneider: Michael, can I just ask you to spotlight? Two things that are itching in me, one is clarification. Cause I know the meaning of the word transformation is meaningful to you and deliberate to you.
So I'd love if you could just spotlight on that for a moment and when you're ready, we should do got my chimes and all my apps lined up for my mindful meditation.
Okay. Okay. Really quickly when I say change, what comes to mind?
Anita Steven Farrah, when you
Michael Sugarman: think about, the word change
Anita's Interpretation of Change
Anita: well my, my husband said, you, you are not the woman that I'm married, so that's that's been my change. I went through every single step that you had on that chart. And I went from shame to pride. So this has been my, my, my journey, and I'm happy to, and I'm still married that he accepted my change.
Michael Sugarman: So when I use the term transform, what comes to mind,
Stephen's Interperetation of Change
Stephen: what comes to mind to me is At different stage, it's a different stage of the development. That's what comes to my mind.
Uri Schneider: Yeah.
Farah:
Farah's Interpreatation of Change
Farah: I agree with Steven as well. Like it's it's, you're no longer the same, and yet there is some learnings from it.
Perfect.
Uri's Interpretation of Change
Uri Schneider: So
I'll just add, I also was inspired by Stephen and Farrah. I have a different kind of mind. So the first time I thought a change, I think you pay with a bill and they get it back change.
But I think that also captures what Stephen and Farrah were alluding to. Not to exclude Anita, but she took it another place. Change suggests like this was here before and now it's gone and now there's a change. It suggests like out with the old, in with the new, more than transformation, I think of as a kid and the recent movie series transformers, it's an evolution, it's a change, but not one that's out with the old it's evolving with the same pieces into something with more power.
Michael Sugarman: And this concept of going from shame to pride is accepting not only the stuttering, but your whole self in the love and not being ashamed. We should maybe have another hour with this Uri because, so what we're doing in the mental health community okay.
Uri Schneider: I think some of our kids and spouses won't go for that right now, unplanned.
Thoughts on Mental Health
Michael Sugarman: Okay. So let's move on to a mindful meditation and app. So what's happening like tomorrow, it's called rural meditation day. So it's within the mental health month as what we've all been saying and how mindfulness works well, the meditation.
Uri Schneider: So we talked
at the beginning about Anita bat lead off and Steven was the second batter.
And then Farrah, the third, if baseball. So Michael's in the cleanup spot for the home run hitter. So if we follow that analogy today is his spring training for mindfulness because tomorrow is opening day. So today we're focusing on really mental health and why it's relevant far beyond the confines of what you might've thought before.
And I think I've included the website of mental health action day, and they have a whole collection of things that you can look at in terms of different actions you can take and just reframing how we think about it. But I think what's beautiful today is looking at this intersection for people who stutter.
And people who, again, I think of embody transcending, stuttering, not in a anything related to the name of a podcast, but just, that's what I think of. And I think of it as a word that is respectful and borrows, from what I think of transformation, it's not a, it's not a fixed version. It's it's a, it's an evolved version.
It's like a fine wine and it's maybe even taken some that something was a challenge and now it's become actually a catapult or a springboard or something that rises up. It doesn't mean it's always easy and it doesn't mean it's linear and it looks different for everybody. But looking at how that journey borrows leans on necessitates and Michael's image before talking about mindfulness and just mental wellness.
So I think it's wonderful. So today we're going to get a walk through this mindful meditation, and then tomorrow you can use all these apps to give it a go for world meditation day. So this is awesome. Michael, thank you so much.
Michael Discusses the Meditation App "Shine"
Michael Sugarman: Thank you. Yeah. One of the apps that, that I want to tell, talk to people about is Shine.
Shine is designed and owned by people of color. So don't think of, the thinking of meditation is just for white people or it's just for, or just going to the spa. It's we had just experienced here in the states and around the world, George Floyd, and which everybody knows about during that time, because there was so much trauma, the black community did a lot of meditation and we did a lot of trauma around that.
And just sitting with that feeling,
Uri Schneider: Michael, we're always connected. Just yesterday, where was it? Someone has to remind me, but I was just talking about a podcast that I listened to on a run, Tim Ferris, interviewing George Mumford, African-American and a mindfulness guru of a different sort, as Michael said, it's not what you might think of when you picture somebody in yoga pants and mindfulness.
But he was considered one of the greatest coaches and trainers of the likes of Michael Jordan and Kobe Bryant. And it was brought into the Chicago bulls. So as Michael saying, I think open up your mind to mindfulness looking different colors, different shapes, different sizes, but also bringing it into places in life that you didn't think about.
Corporate. What does corporate want with mindfulness? It does because they see it has an impact speech therapists, teachers in the classroom, parents at home. You think the kids too young, there are ways to adapt and bring these principles to life, but the impact and the doors that can open when you explore inner space, unreal.
Michael Sugarman: Thank you. The other thing is the website that that Uri has posted is not just an English. It's an every language because here in the states, we're a multi I'm from California. So we're 38% Latinex. So we're trying to reach out to the community, like what Uri was talking about. So let's get started.
I just want to do a a really
Uri Schneider: Tu hablas mi lingua.
Michael Sugarman: And in Hebrew Uri!
Laughing Yoga Demonstration
Michael Sugarman: To begin this I'm going to share with you what we do in laughing yoga. Okay. So what I would like you to sit there, but your arms around yourself and go three times hug one, two. Three, clap your hands. Very good. Very good. Yay.
Make sure you know that yoga and meditation, it's hard, because most people think, oh my God, how can I do a five minute sit? How could I spend so much time? The monk say who doesn't have that problem? And letting your mind wander. So just remember what we do we try to do is just a short to getting people to do mindfulness now because it's mental health day.
Discussing Self Care
Michael Sugarman: I just want to ask one question to you here in the states, including brushing your teeth and taking a shower. How much time do you think Americans spent on the average on self care on health self-care.
15 minutes. And that includes brushing teeth. So think about yourself of taking that time. And that's the reason why this employment resource group URI is trying to do all these taking time because they do meditation and mindfulness traveling.
Meditation Exercise
Michael Sugarman: So what I wanna do is sit back in your chair, do this, and just breathe in through your nose
and through your mouth,
breathe in
and out,
breathe in,
hold the breath. And when we ring my charm, And I'm going to hold that and then we'll begin our journey.
Continue to
breathe
in and out.
Imagine yourself
at the
beach. Why don't you just squeeze the sand between your toes? Just squeeze squeeze, squeeze.
Do that exercise again. Squeeze, squeeze, and let go.
I want you to have your hands, put your hands in the sand and squeeze the sand squeeze, squeeze and let go.
Do that again.
I want you to think about an emotion that you're dealing with right now, it could be shame, anxiety, frustration.
It could be, what's your mind thinking about with getting to work or getting, not to work, taking care of your kids? Think about the process that you're having right now.
How big is that in your life? Take a ball and look at that ball
Feel that ball. And how's that ball making you feel?
Breathe in and breathe out. Now, I want you to imagine someone has now joined you on the beach. It could be somebody like a teacher. It could be somebody from your past, somebody in your life or somebody that you feel loved and support.
What would you be telling that person about that emotion?
I'm going to ring the bell and at the end of the bell, I want us to come back.
So that's, that is called loving kindness emotion. Okay. So it, yeah, it's another way of getting people of learning that process of looking at what's going on in their life and like what Anita said if you draw a line, you put one side of the future, the other side paths, and then you make a stick figure.
Present is where you are.
And so in in our world now is that we want people to start to, have that present oriented thing. Because you realizing that you're struggling with all this stuff much you're taking. And so we want you to spend some time for yourself.
Uri Schneider: The first time that I spoke with you, Michael, on the podcast that can November, you did this with me.
And it was a surprise because I thought you were going to come on and talk about it. And before I knew it, you had me doing this laughing yoga thing, which was totally out of my comfort zone, but it totally went with you. If y'all want to see me totally out of my comfort zone, check it out. But I'd love if everyone here is comfortable, Michael, maybe you could walk us through because there's nothing like doing it.
Reflecting on Exercise and Sharing Experiences
Uri Schneider: So like we have the benefit of you just walked us through that. Anybody that's listening that just went through that you're present, you're more grounded. You're more focused. I would imagine. Having done that than before. So I don't know, Michael, how you would facilitate this little group we have here just to reflect on that.
Obviously no one should share if they don't want to or share anything that's uncomfortable, but Michael, I'd love for you to lead that. You know what it could look like to pull the group and see what you could, what wisdom we can bring. Oh,
Michael Sugarman: What person did you talk to and what was your emotion?
Now,
Uri Schneider: if someone wants, when someone wants to unmute, no, Michael, I just might give you permission. If anyone wants to respond, they can. And if they don't, that's cool too.
Michael Sugarman: I was going to give the group some idea, like some people have talked about how they talk to their six year old about their stuttering, how they're in their seventies.
They wish that someone would have talked to them. Some people talk like to a barber and going like why a barber? Because no judgment felt like going to, there was no family dynamic there. Someone said their mother, someone said, their partner, their wife, their boyfriend, girlfriend. So we just don't know about how comfortable people feel.
So that's the reason why we try to, and then in this kind of a group, we want people to start to share about current feelings, so we're trying to get focused. And like when Anita started us out, we w we all were talking about mental health and that is you can't take back the past. You can learn what's going to happen in the future.
You're very present right now, talking about that emotion. So I would ask that for the group. And
Stephen: would you like me to go
Michael Sugarman: over here? I don't. Yeah, Uri is that? .
Uri Schneider: No, Mike, you're the hero you're in charge. I had that read that Steven. Yeah. Something rich that he wanted to share.
Stephen Shares Meditation Exercise Experience
Stephen: Yeah, no.
I just really went into a space there and on the beach where I was talking to my father and I was at the emotion that I was stressing about was I was trying to see where like where on my own, like, where is my.
Where is my future path like? And I was, there is still doing the job that you're doing or doing something else?
And I could just hear my father's voice in my ear just saying, don't sweat it. Just don't sweat it, so yeah, that's what I wanted to share. Thank you.
Michael Sugarman: Thank you.
Anita Shares Meditation Exercise Experience
Anita: Can I share too? Yeah.
When he was saying beach then my mouth was like this big suddenly, because water is my space. And I've been to the California beach and with a very special friend. We were walking there. We were doing the same with our toes in the sand, andand our hands in the sand and we were eating a frozen banana.
And that day we shared so much, and it was stuttering. It was family, it was life. And and I cried a lot but from joy, because I could share this and I was in this moment with my best friend on this wonderful place. There was a moment where I let go a lot of my thoughts, emotions, fears, and I share that as through sharing, I felt so free that I cried with joy.
Michael Sugarman: So about, we're trying to go for positive reframing from negative to positive, and what Anita said was last week we had a webinar called nature and mental health and there's close to 50K that came onto that webinar. And, so it's usually maybe about three hours of a therapist going whoa.
Yeah, get outside. I'm going to ask, because its mental health
Uri Share's David Shapiro's Stuttering Experience
Uri Schneider: I can't resist. I'll just share one snippet anecdote to what Michael just said. It's not in the movie Transcending stuttering but my father's interview with David Shapiro. A man who is another Legend and both his contributions to the community, but also his textbooks and research as a person who stutters and as a professional.
And he talks about his own therapy as a young person, and he talks about going to therapy and he doesn't remember what they did. And he doesn't remember what they talked about, that your members, that the therapist asked them where do you like to be? And he said, I like to hike. I like to walk in the woods.
And that's what they did. They took walks. And in the silence, he says this beautiful line. I always remember. It's imprinted on my forehead "in the silence more was said than any words could." And just being in the place that I wanted to be in a place that was my happy place like Anita was describing.
And yeah, if we could meet each other and create that space for each other, I think of that all the time. And I think it's counterintuitive to a lot of parents, educators, therapists, but if one can do it professionally and with ethical responsibility and all the things that ensure the safety of everybody involved it can be an incredibly different experience than being in a four, four walls with no windows put aside the whole COVID situation, but being outdoors can be very opening and freeing and being in that place where person feels most comfortable open.
Michael Sugarman: And and that connection is not only to the other person that you're talking with and sharing, but you're also connecting with nature or what you're doing the yoga and, you're this connectedness. So because it's mental health day. So I want to address,
Uri Schneider: did anyone else want to add something before Michael goes to the next point?
Farah's Shares Meditation Exercise Experience
Farah: It's fine. It's fine. It's
I just loved that it was the beach. It's truly my happy face, happy face? Happy place! But it was very, it was like a mini vacation that my body needed and it was possible within those few minutes. So thank you so very much.
Uri Explains Meditation can be Short but Meaningful
Uri Schneider: Thank you. I'll just riff on that back on, on enough fixturing the beach in Dubai.
Hopefully we'll be there as soon, but the idea of micro-dosing this, I think would Farrah just said it's the for Farah, it's the end of the day for others, it's the middle of the day for others. It's early morning for Michael and LA, in California, in Oakland, but the ability to a small dose of this and the benefit is remarkable.
So I think the other thing that people have, which is a misconception is that, oh, this requires, a three-day retreat like silence. And that's certainly a powerful dosing and can be an incredible experience for people. Who've done it, but it can also be done in as far as that just three minutes.
And what a profound vacation feeling it delivered. And then even coming out of it, this feeling of wow, my inbox isn't as bad as it would have been if I went on a three-day retreat and I still got a vacation, look at that's more doable.
Michael Explains Mind and Body Process
Michael Sugarman: Absolutely. It's doable and it's assessable. So I want to end with what is going on in our field and that is this mind and body process.
And so it's, we should say street language? We call it to getting out of thinking traps and therapeutic. We go cognitive behavior therapy, or we call in dialectical behavior therapy, opposite action. So you do your thinking if basically you act opposite to what you're thinking. And, it's just, again, I'm trying to bring it home to us, the people that stutter. So let me throw this past year. This isn't just a comment. The human brain reacts more intensely to negative events than to positive ones. We intensify the negative when we hold on to the positive, rather than the praise than the positive, just how our brain is often wired.
So we're trying to move away from that. So let me give you what we're doing here through the mental health community. Oh okay. So what percentage of people here in the state do you think worry about things that never happens at all? Never happens, but they worry about it. It's going to happen to me is catastrophizing it's overgeneralization.
How many people?
90%. So now out of that, 10% of times where the worries in their life come true. What percentage of people do you think handled the difficulty better than expected or learned a valuable lesson?
90%. So what we're trying to teach is these mindful skills say if you're going to worry, what are you going to learn from that rather than holding onto the negative? So it's this, what we use is that term is cognitive distortions and it's just, our brain is wired that way. You can think in our own lives, what do we hold on to more?
It's the negative of praise? It's just how we're wired. And so what we're trying to do is to move away from that. So the integration of this whole reframing journal writing gratitude journal writing is about that, of getting it down on paper. Now, when we say journal writing, we're not saying for you to write your whole page, it could be just two words.
I'm upset. The other thing is because some of us had worked in with severely depressed folks and suicidal folks. We asked them to make their beds every morning, make their beds or to water their plants, or, to breathe outside for a minute. And what that gives them is. Positivity.
They come back home, the beds made, oh,that feels good!. I needed, these simple little simple things that we're trying to do in people's lives to try to make that negativity to positive, going to the beach for five minutes and processing
that.
Uri Schneider: So mindful of how much I'm sparking and also grounding and how much listeners and people watching are processing.
So there's dosing, there's also time that people are allotted and I'm just sensitive and mindful of that. So this shouldn't become stressful. Yeah. But certainly Michael, the resounding feeling in this little room here with the five of us and coming in with comments from. Many of our good friends. I don't want to miss anybody, but a lot of great comments and reflections on what you asked about change versus transformation.
I love seeing all these comments we'll come back and review them is like we got to come back for more. We could listen to you and sit with you for so long.
Closing Remarks
Uri Schneider: So I just want to bring us home. Do you, Michael, and anyone else want to just offer any closing words or thoughts of reflection on the theme of mindfulness, of mental wellness of how it relates to stuttering journeys and also hopes for the future?
Or just any thought? And just, if anyone wants to raise a hand and give a thought, Anita can give a go and everybody can have a chance and then we'll bring it home.
Anita's Closing Remarks
Anita: The biggest help that I got from mindfulness is those four, four letters, S O A L, and it says Stop Observe, what is going on?
What's the problem or the issue, and then the A is for you either Act or you Accept and then the L is Let go. And especially the L was major. And I use it with my stutter. I use it when I'm in, in in a queue, in, in the, in, in the shop. And that there's a problem in my queue, of course, as always, or when I have to clean the toilet, every single moment I use this, these four letters and they have changed.
So much fun for me now. Especially when I got ill, that was my second journey. And I used these four letters you can, and I use these exercises and it I can cope today with what's the single nuisances, like cleaning the toilet, but also the big issues. Thanks to mindfulness.
Uri Schneider: The S can be the hardest one just to get started with stopping and then having the next ones to follow up and observe and choose to accept or to take an action and then to let it go. And maybe another L would be to give a little self-love. But that was beautiful. Anita, thank you so much for that.
But anyone else like to share a parting thought, Farah?
Farah's Closing Remarks
Farah: Thank you so much. I think this is. This is one of the many takeaways I'm going to take with me from today's session, because it's very, it's a very simple yet. So powerful. So thank you. Mindfulness is something that once we've gotten into the habit of practicing it in our own terms and our own definition, it's not a, it's not as, as we've been saying, it's not, you need to do one, two or three, but whatever works for me to release that stress release, that worry that anger.
It's very important for anyone's well being. But I think also for people who stutter, because what is on the outside is just a fraction of what's happening within us
So, thank you.
Uri Schneider: Thank you Farah, anyone else want to share a word, Stephen?
Stephen's Closing Remarks
Stephen: Yeah. Just to finish for myself would be even just the ability to un-clutter or the mind for a short period of time. Even like the beach there. It was a lovely feeling. So thank you everybody.
Uri Schneider: Thank you, Michael.
Michael's Closing Remarks
Michael Sugarman: Thank you for being, letting me into this great community and really a loving community.
And it's in this transformation of that. We could see it, that people are opening up and talking about it and talking about their stutter and making that a world a better place for everybody. And this concept of going from shame to pride is accepting not only the stuttering, but your whole self in the love and not being ashamed.
And thank you about you're creating this transformation. Thank you.
Uri's Closing Remarks
Uri Schneider: Just guiding and bringing people together. I had a thought when I was running earlier, I'll just share it, closing thought as much as I don't believe in us and them. I think there are two kinds of people in the world and everybody can decide of which group they subscribe.
There are the people that everything's just fine. They got it all taken care of and they're pretty self-sufficient and satisfied just as things are. And then there are people that feel like they're hungry for a little bit more. There's something, they feel, it could be a bit better. They feel they could be a bit more themselves.
They could feel a little bit more of something inside of them. Isn't yet getting to express itself. And I don't just mean words. I subscribed to the latter group and what Michael said, that's what this transcending stuttering community is about. That's what this whole series is. That's what this is all about for people who stutter and for professionals who care to, to come at it with fresh eyes to really redefine what it means in a much broader context, but by bringing together people who are hungry and have that fire inside of them and bring everybody around the campfire and to sit together and share space in our own minds and our own hearts, and then share when and how we choose to all of us are smarter than any of us.
And that's a tribute to one of our mentors, Dr. Joel Stark. But that's what this whole transcending stuttering thing is about. So if you care about the podcast, it was funny. I reached out to one person I've owned, embarrassed them. They said, oh, your podcast, oh, I listened to it all the time. And I'm like, oh, I had no idea because I never heard from you or you never dropped a review.
So if you like the podcast, or if you like anything, you can help us by sharing these messages, share it, subscribe, like not for some vanity metrics, but truly just to share it with people who are sitting in some basement by themselves. And this might be that opener that helps them realize they're not alone and helps them realize they're not the only ones that are thinking and feeling those feelings that they don't have anywhere to air out.
And if you're a professional hungry to learn about this, I'm putting together and inviting some of our greatest teachers. They're all right here. And others around the world and we can all listen and grow and help one another. And so the goal is that no one should feel alone and no one should feel stuck going asleep at night with no idea where to go with that feeling, that they got something inside themselves to know that there's where to go.
And as Michael's model shows, there are different layers of that. There are different a sequence of ways to do that. Self-help working with an individual professional of different sorts being part of a cohort community, having an ongoing support group that's asynchronous so many avenues. So if you want to join us Schneider speech.com/tsa is one way, and we're bringing people together.
And again, if you're all set, God bless and I think radical acceptance. Also, I just want to leave with this thought that Michael talks about radical acceptance. We often think applies to ourselves. We have to learn, tend to autophagy. Also give it to others who think differently. Who speak differently.
And I'm talking about those people who think someone has to change the way they talk or change the way they dress. We have to have more tolerance and acceptance of others in that sense. And those of us that are digging this mindfulness thing, and someone is kicking and screaming, they don't want any piece of it to have the ability to show also the tolerance and acceptance of their opposite experience in that moment.
And to honor it and to have radical acceptance for ourselves as much as we do for others and for others, as much as we do ourselves and truly the people here are my great teachers. So I want to thank first and foremost, Michael Sugarman as well as so Michael coming in from California, Anita from Sweden beyond words, Stephen from Ireland and Farrah from Dubai, UAE.
Thank you so much. It's been an honor to share the time and I wish everyone a wonderful day and a great weekend.